Thermal Spray misc questions
07-16-2007, 12:23 AM,
#1
Thermal Spray misc questions
hi all, i have several questions that need to consult experts here,

1. Thermal spray coatings are sprayed layer by layer. If one small area of coating (e.g. TBC) cracks or no bonding due to poor surface preparation, can we re-spray that area instead of rework the whole work-piece? Can we say that the re-spray coating quality is low because of separation of splat (so splat cohesion low) & many porosities?

2. What's the difference between 3MB & 9MB gun?

3. What's the difference between diamond jet gun & HVOF? Can both share the powders?

4. What's difference between Aluminum oxide (e.g. Metco 105NS) and Zirconium oxide (e.g. Metco 204NS-G) in TBC? How to choose between them? If I not wrong, sevice temperature for alumina is 1650C while zirconia is 1010C. Alumina is dielectric.

5. What's difference between Metco 202NS (zirconia 80, yttria 20) & 204NS (zirconia 92, yttria 8)?

6. There are many bond coat, e.g. Amdry 962, Metco 443, Metco 404. How to choose among them?

7. How to choose sand grit (aluminum oxide) size? Depends on process (e.g. HVOF, wire, plasma) or on coating ?
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07-17-2007, 12:50 AM,
#2
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
Hi Powerman

Sign0016 to the Surface Engineering forum.

Quote:1. Thermal spray coatings are sprayed layer by layer. If one small area of coating (e.g. TBC) cracks or no bonding due to poor surface preparation, can we re-spray that area instead of rework the whole work-piece? Can we say that the re-spray coating quality is low because of separation of splat (so splat cohesion low) & many porosities?

In the majority of cases I would NOT recommend patch repairs.

Quote:2. What's the difference between 3MB & 9MB gun?

Age mainly. 3MB rated to 40KW, 7/9MB rated to 80KW, very closely related and use very similar parameter settings unlike comparing to say an F1 or F4 gun.


Quote:3. What's the difference between diamond jet gun & HVOF? Can both share the powders?

Diamond Jet is an HVOF process, do you mean comparison like between DJ and JP5000? They very different in design and operation, but similar in that they produce an HVOF jet and high quality coatings. They can share the same powders, but one powder may be more suited to one than the other.

Quote:4. What's difference between Aluminum oxide (e.g. Metco 105NS) and Zirconium oxide (e.g. Metco 204NS-G) in TBC? How to choose between them? If I not wrong, sevice temperature for alumina is 1650C while zirconia is 1010C. Alumina is dielectric.

Pure alumina and zirconia both have poor properties with regard to high temperature thermal cycling or thermal shock. This is due to certain solid state phase changes during heating and cooling which stress the coating severely. A Metco 204 type zirconia coating has stabilising elements added like yttria which modify these phase changes and makes them thermally shock resistant. Alumina is good at very high temperatures, but usually its a one off as in rocket nose cones, it does not like thermal cycling.

Quote:5. What's difference between Metco 202NS (zirconia 80, yttria 20) & 204NS (zirconia 92, yttria 8)?

202NS is whats called a fully stabilised zircomia FSZ and 204NS is a partially stabilised zirconia PSZ. The PSZ tend to show the best thermal spall and shock resisting properties. To explain why is not easy here. You will need to study the zirconia-yttria phase diagram to understand all the different phases and their transformations during heating and cooling.

Quote:6. There are many bond coat, e.g. Amdry 962, Metco 443, Metco 404. How to choose among them?

Many years ago molybdenum was the prime bond coat material until the arrival of the nickel aluminium composites and the so called "one step coatings" or "self bonding coatings" like 442 and 447 etc. Nickel aluminium alloy (not composite) is now very popular. These coatings primarily produce very high bond strengths to the substrate and also provide the right type of surface texture to maximise bonding of the top coat. Another group of so called bond coats do not necessarily improve initial tensile bond strength, but primarily are used as anti-corrosion or thermal oxidation buffer layers. Coatings like NiCr, Hastelloy C, inconel 625, NiCrAl, MCrAlY etc. Generally your NiAl and one steps are good for general purpose high bond strength systems, but tend not to be so good in corrosive or very high temperature oxidation. Your choice depends very much on the environment, substrate and top coat.

Quote:7. How to choose sand grit (aluminum oxide) size? Depends on process (e.g. HVOF, wire, plasma) or on coating ?

Primary requirement is a very sharp etch/texture as opposed to a shot peen like surface. This is probably more important than the actual roughness Ra value obtained. Generally,
the thinner and finer the coating, the finer the grit. I have not found that the commomly held belief that the rougher the blast profile the higher the bond strength is necessarily true.

Hope that helps
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07-17-2007, 04:10 AM,
#3
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
hi Gordon, thanks for your reply.

How to explain "not recommend for patch repair" ? Can we say it is because of porosity, impurity inside make the patch coating quality low?
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07-18-2007, 07:10 PM,
#4
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
Hi Powerman

Even with good patch repairs, metallography usually reveals a fault line between old and new coating. Patch repair requires considerable skill in removing faulty area of coating, preparing surface to accept new coating, spraying localised area with right amount of overlap and blending new coating with old. Other problems can occur like if a bond coat is required, then the bond coat interface will be exposed on coating surface at the edges of repair when the coating is finished machined/ground. High risk of contamination of old coating during preparation stages before application of repair coating. If you have coating with obvious localised problem, how can you be sure that this is not just the "tip of the iceberg" with more extensive problems going unseen.

Once I watched some guys trying to patch a coating with a tiny crack fault (overly thick area of coating) on a very large component (worth trying I suppose in this situation). They started grinding and chipping out the small faulty area only to find new cracks propagating into adjacent coating areas. After removing nearly a square meter of coating, they seemed happy and started to grit blast the area only to find the coating edges were again cracking and lifting. At this point they realised they were chasing their tails and decided to remove all of the coating an start again.
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07-19-2007, 12:24 AM,
#5
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
hi Gordon, thanks for your detailed explanation.

Thanks You.
Reply
08-15-2007, 06:37 AM,
#6
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
Hi,
I just wanted to add few points,
1.ZrO2 in pure form transforms from a high temp. cubic form to a room temp. monoclinic structure,which is accompanied by a large volume change and the formation of cracks in the deposit.The high temp. cubic form can be 'stabilized' by adding appropriate quantities of Cao, MgO,Y2O3,or CeO2, and are termed as X-stablisied ZrO2(whereX=stabilising agent).As Gordon has pointed out, further improvement in thermal shock resistance can be achieved by using PSZ( please refer to my book on Surface Wear-Analysis , Treatment, and Prevention,ASM-International p253-254 for detailed explanation)
2.I am not conversant with METCO gun types.However early version of HVOF used to have lower flame velocity and thus suffered from severe limititations with respect to coating thickness particularly for hard carbides and ceramics.Development of higher gas jet velocity(1.5 times than earlier system) HVOF has made it possible to overcome these limitations.
(for further details refer to my second book, p207-212)
ram chattopadhyay
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09-20-2007, 12:09 AM,
#7
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
hi ram,

Thanks for your reply.
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06-21-2010, 07:07 AM,
#8
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
Hello Sir,

Regarding your discussion about bond coat below, does the Diamalloy 4008 NS also a bond coat powder?

Is there any difference in HVOF procedures (+preparation procedure) if the base metal is made of stainless steel.

I'm new in the thermal spray, any literature good for reading for the HVOF?

Thank you.

(07-17-2007, 12:50 AM)Gordon Wrote: Hi Powerman

......

Quote:6. There are many bond coat, e.g. Amdry 962, Metco 443, Metco 404. How to choose among them?

Many years ago molybdenum was the prime bond coat material until the arrival of the nickel aluminium composites and the so called "one step coatings" or "self bonding coatings" like 442 and 447 etc. Nickel aluminium alloy (not composite) is now very popular. These coatings primarily produce very high bond strengths to the substrate and also provide the right type of surface texture to maximise bonding of the top coat. Another group of so called bond coats do not necessarily improve initial tensile bond strength, but primarily are used as anti-corrosion or thermal oxidation buffer layers. Coatings like NiCr, Hastelloy C, inconel 625, NiCrAl, MCrAlY etc. Generally your NiAl and one steps are good for general purpose high bond strength systems, but tend not to be so good in corrosive or very high temperature oxidation. Your choice depends very much on the environment, substrate and top coat.
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06-23-2010, 01:41 PM,
#9
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
Hi arlen.nurlan

Sign0016 to the Surface Engineering Forum.

Quote:Regarding your discussion about bond coat below, does the Diamalloy 4008 NS also a bond coat powder?

Diamalloy 4008 NS is a nickel aluminium alloy powder and has good bonding properties and can be useful as a bond coat. However, many HVOF coatings have high bond strengths and would not normally be enhanced by using a bond coat. Where very thick coatings are required (to restore dimension) Diamalloy 4008 NS and its like are very useful as under coats to top coats that have low thickness limitation or are just expensive.

Quote:Is there any difference in HVOF procedures (+preparation procedure) if the base metal is made of stainless steel.

In general, no, the basic rules apply. Though, depending on what stainless steel, coating and service application etc. there may be some special considerations.

Quote:I'm new in the thermal spray, any literature good for reading for the HVOF?

First, often neglected study equipment and process manuals supplied with the equipment and materials. A lot of material on the internet, just requires effort in searching, but much of it is free. The ASM Thermal Spray Society is probably a good place to find relevant literature, but much at cost.
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07-12-2011, 09:58 AM,
#10
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
(07-12-2011, 02:33 AM)Khairul Anwar Wrote: Greetings to All,

I got a question here, I am using the Diamalloy 2004 powder for my HVOF coating and there is a problem on surface roughness. I am looking for 2.0mRa and below, but getting alomost double of the requirement. Anyone have any idea??
Thanks

Hi Khairul Anwar

Thought this would be best as a new thread. Moved to http://www.gordonengland.co.uk/sef/Threa...ss-problem

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07-13-2011, 03:54 PM,
#11
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
In continuation to what Powerman asked about the Alumina and Zirconia,

Are there any additives or stabilizing agents that could reduce the tendency of Alumina to crack due to Thermal Shock. After all Alumina is cheaper than Zirconia and therefore would prove beneficial for non-critical applications.

Is it possible to blend Alumina with softer materials like Ni, Cu, Co, etc to attain comparatively thermal shock resistant coatings without sacrificing the TB property to a major extent?

Does any one also have the Thermal Barrier properties for Alumina and Zirconia in terms of Degree C per mm?

Regards

K09
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07-15-2011, 08:12 AM,
#12
RE: Thermal Spray misc questions
metco 365-2 and norton 202tsp are used as a thermal barrier coating on the combusion liners of many different oem turbine engines.

i've always wondered how they would be in a 2 stoke snowmobile engine Smile on the piston tops.
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